• bob.k posted a new activity comment 11 months, 2 weeks ago

    ok so no more sermons, mansplaining, or patronizing @reena@temperance I do get upset @enzedgirl when i see some one pick a fight., knock that person to the ground then kick them in the guts while they are down. as i see it that’s what you did to frog. all because your bullshit detector went off. I am not going to stand by and say…
    Reply Delete Edit

    • Fucking hell @bob-k you said yourself you didn’t even read the exchanges between me and frog.

      I did no such thing.

      I challengedfrog on blaming her husband for her drinking.

      Then I challenged her on two plus years of saying she’s going to stop drinking and not doing it.

      I am not discussing this with you any more. I will consider any more posts from you on the subject harassment.

      @mrs-d

      @temperance @morgan @reena

  • bob.k posted an update 11 months, 2 weeks ago

    Hi @enzedgirl an enabler is usually a family member who lives with the addict, the enabler acts out of shame, embarrassment and fear to protect themselves from the addict and their behaviour.Thats not you. Your words “I think there comes a point when I’m no longer willing to collude?” You put a question mark. I am not going to respond to that and that not because I am short of words or thoughts I just can’t find a nice way to say what I am thinking, confrontation is never nice plus there are 6500 people, strangers listening in on our conversation and I would be very surprised if that had no influence on how my comments affected you. I have good intentions but there is a chance you could be hurt by my words- and if that happens we both lose. It would be different if we were sitting down with coffee sharing a slice of carrot cake — if you don’t like carrot cake we would work something out.
    Hi @Sobere I hope you are well. I appreciate your concern. for my wellbeing. I got involved because I was invited in by enzedgirl.
    Hi @Temperance I hear what you are saying but frog is a person, not a post on a web site and I think its good to keep that In mind.

    • Dude…
      I just…
      I can’t even….
      Thanks for the entertainment.

    • @bobk, I think you have good things to say however, to me, your posts read like “the sermon from the mount” type of thing where you are patiently explaining things to a child. When you explain things as if you have the correct information instead of what is just basically your point of view. (explaining the term codependent, then saying that’s not you) There is a term for this and it’s called “mansplaining” and its when men explain things to women in a patronizing tone. Things that women may already have lots of knowledge about. Your message may be lost in the voice you have taken in your posts. No one has absolute authority on recovery or even the psychology of addiction. We are all just positing our views. I am sure my views are colored by my life experience also.

    • Seems like you’re pretty annoyed with me @bob-k and pretty much judging me. I also almost missed your post because it’s not connected with any prior conversation

      I don’t really have much more to say about it all.

      Maybe it would be helpful for you to think about why this has upset you so much. I’m guessing it doesn’t have anything much to do with me but you seem intent on teaching me a lesson.

      • ok so no more sermons, mansplaining, or patronizing @reena@temperance I do get upset @enzedgirl when i see some one pick a fight., knock that person to the ground then kick them in the guts while they are down. as i see it that’s what you did to frog. all because your bullshit detector went off. I am not going to stand by and say…[Read more]
        Reply Delete Edit

        • Fucking hell @bob-k you said yourself you didn’t even read the exchanges between me and frog.

          I did no such thing.

          I challengedfrog on blaming her husband for her drinking.

          Then I challenged her on two plus years of saying she’s going to stop drinking and not doing it.

          I am not discussing this with you any more. I will consider any more posts from you on the subject harassment.

          @mrs-d

          @temperance @morgan @reena

  • bob.k posted an update 11 months, 3 weeks ago

    Hi @enzedgirl re your invite to respond. Bullshit detectors are handy things to have, I have one but I think they need to be treated a bit like smoke alarms. that ear piercing noise they make does not always mean there is a fire that you have to put out. In fact more often than not there is no fire just a bit of burnt toast. so we need a coincided response, water can do more damage than smoke.
    I have not read all of the exchanges between you and @Frog but enzedgirl it appears that frog was badly hurt by the words you wrote. In my mind this calls for an apology not an explanation or justification As @morgan said to frog “you did not set out to hurt her” and I believe that but the fact is frog was hurt.
    A thought -If you what to test your ideas and have difficult conversations it could be a good idea to involve people you know that can handle it/ benefit from it. Your words “This is an extremely safe, warm, kind place”. I think those of you that have been around here awhile have a responsibility to show leadership and make sure it stays that way for everybody.

    • Hi there. I think everyone here has the responsibility to show leadership and keep this place safe, regardless of length of time here or length of sobriety. We do a bang up amazing job together in this place.
      Occasionally there will be a conflict. It’s incredible that it happens so rarely that it shocks us a bit. We work it through understanding that tensions can run high for a little while and then we let it disappear down the feed. We let it go with love and get on with the business of being the best little sacred space in town.

    • Hi @bob-k thanks for your thoughts.

      I’m more along the lines of @temperance ‘s thinking.

      I think there comes a point when I’m no longer willing to collude.

      I think in AA it’s called “enabling”.

  • bob.k posted a new activity comment 11 months, 3 weeks ago

    Hi NigelPM how to sort that storm probably depends on what caused the disappointment is it the result of something you did or did not do or was caused by action or inaction of others,

  • bob.k posted a new activity comment 11 months, 3 weeks ago

    HI Ro if angry /hurtful stuff is coming out of my mouth its mostly a reflection of how I see myself as person. I was told ” if I cant love myself then I am not capable of showing love to other people”. in other words if I don’t treat myself with care, respect, understanding and empathy it is going to very differcult to treat others that way.. I came across this poem when I first got sober and it started the journey for me http://www.inspirationpeak.com/cgi-bin/poetry.cgi?record=155 .

  • bob.k posted a new activity comment 11 months, 3 weeks ago

    Hi @NigelPM This may be relevant maybe not. Often resentments are preceded by expectations. In AA speak- Expectations are premeditated resentments. and for me this can lead down the path to believing I am a victim and that’s not healthy. The up side of not have great expectations is that if something goes my way I have a reason to be grateful.– take care

    • @bob.k…yes,that makes sense, but how do I stop the storm in the mind that comes from disappointment?

      • Hi @nigelpm. The way is to accept the world as it is, not as how you would like it to be. Examine the resentment to see if you had some part in it… It may be that not all the blame lies with the other party. If you’re still finding all the fault as theirs then your way out is still forgiveness. Don’t forgive them because they deserve forgiveness, forgive them because you deserve peace.

      • @Dave H….sagely advice and very true, I cant seem to stand back though and be philisophical. Its awful being reactive

      • Hi NigelPM how to sort that storm probably depends on what caused the disappointment is it the result of something you did or did not do or was caused by action or inaction of others,

  • bob.k posted a new activity comment 11 months, 3 weeks ago

    good one just tell it to “go a way” simple really and it works

  • bob.k posted a new activity comment 11 months, 3 weeks ago

    Hi SteveF the last part of the second step in AA talks about “restore us to sanity”. We known there is no off switch that we are in control of– right. So that leaves us with 2 options, do we to hit the on switch or do we keep away from it and that is our decision to make. The only way alcohol can get past our lips is if we put it there. our arm does not have a mind of its own it can only do what we ask it to do. A way to manage this is to think about what we are thinking about –and keep our hand well away from a glass. Its the first sip that starts a journey that’s we know is going to end with pain -we choose to drink– we don’t slip

  • bob.k posted a new activity comment 11 months, 4 weeks ago

    hi @morgan is that a question for me? If so I don’t quiet understand what you are saying

  • bob.k posted a new activity comment 11 months, 4 weeks ago

    drink -not drink. the choice is yours to make

  • bob.k posted a new activity comment 11 months, 4 weeks ago

    yea its about getting honest with ourselves

  • bob.k posted a new activity comment 12 months ago

    Hi @Ellislou I am with you and John on that one. I mostly just smile and say ” Yea maybe” ” its a bit of a conversation stopper but it gets people thinking which is not a bad thing. I am not looking for sympathy-just being honest or not- maybe I am just being a bit of an arsehole because I can.

  • bob.k posted a new activity comment 12 months ago

    the thirsty not there– that’s something to be grateful for

  • bob.k posted a new activity comment 12 months ago

    Hi @Darleen Our addict self which is part of our mid brain does not die till we do, it doesn’t even sleep its part of the brain that keeps us breathing and our heart pumping- the stuff we cant do for our selves, science explains how this all works. we just have to believe it or not- that our choice but one drink will never be enough and that’s a fact. Its the first sip that’s the triggers the process that leads our concise mind to believe that our body needs more alcohol. We don’t get to say “yea or nah” at this stage. Our addict uses our arm to pour the alcohol down our throat to met its own needs- it has no concept of the harm this can do to us

  • bob.k posted a new activity comment 12 months ago

    Hi @Morgan “develop their long-term contentment, emotional strength, and resourcefulness”. they are not wrong, as I see it we don’t have much of choice really and its bloody hard work. I get a bit upset when I read this stuff its like they are saying that I am better, stronger.happier person now than I would have been if I had not spent the past 8 years living in a wheelchair with a spinal cord injury, “that’s bullshit” I would go back to the way I was in a flash, there was nothing wrong with who I was and I am sure I would still be a nice person. My family would love the have the old me back, their tears tell me that. I am a great believer in the power of positive thinking, I don’t let the things I cant do get in the way of the things that I can– but you have to be real

    • Oh God, yes I bet there is not one person alive who would not leap at the chance to be back to their able bodied self. Nor a psychologically traumatized one, or a me, wanting my family while, not wrecked by mental illness and now a selfish, narcissistic ex still hurting us ..
      I think this was about research, not positive thinking in adversity. It has also been measured that 6 months after winning lotto or having an awful life event, people tend toward their baseline happiness, neither significantly happier or sadder than they were.
      Of course if you are in pain and the losses are effecting the deepest aspects of the meaning of your life, it takes way longer, or never.
      Because I so believed in family and loyalty, +that my husband would be his lovely self again if he took his meds, it took me 10 years or so to overcome the sorrow. Also, still, the financial hardship…
      But yes, these all can be well pieces can be sickening. There is a great one by a Btitish journo entitled Depression is NOTHING like a broken leg.
      Keep the thoughts flowing. Keep us real xx

    • @bob-k very powerful words! My worst is when people tell John he is lucky to be alive – as he says luck sure sucks if this is lucky !

      • Hi @Ellislou I am with you and John on that one. I mostly just smile and say ” Yea maybe” ” its a bit of a conversation stopper but it gets people thinking which is not a bad thing. I am not looking for sympathy-just being honest or not- maybe I am just being a bit of an arsehole because I can.

      • And such a thoughtless thing to say ( maybeI have been that stupid-hope not). Does anyone ask him, what is it like to have lived through that?

    • So is the more meaningful communication,how do you make any meaning living through this?
      For us here, why stop drinking? How do you manage? if you do have any words about this, I think it is powerful for those who do get caughtinself pity or mundane little problems!
      Dont hold back. Xx

  • bob.k posted an update 12 months ago

    The video sort for talks for itself. Our physical and mental wellbeing is interwoven. The great thing is, that it is activities that we can program into our everyday that start us on this journey towards wellbeing and if we keep at it, these practices becomes habits. very healthy habits. The goal is to create an personal environment (the way we do each day) that promotes an inner peace- If we are at peace with ourselves then there is a chance that those around us we be ok as well.

    Problems are a pain in the arse if you see them as a challenge and focus on the solution — that’s a positive use of energy

  • bob.k posted an update 1 year ago

    keeping it simple- alcohol explained https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZJ1p1VO_wW8

  • bob.k posted a new activity comment 1 year ago

    hi Ro I have just finish reading the book “rational Recovery “all 354 pages of it. I agree, what he says makes a lot of sense but its a pity so much of the book and his website is taken up telling us why AA is bad for us. he seems to see AA as an enemy which is sad, I don’t recommend his program, What if his program does not work for somebody yet they have been convinced that AA is a big con (that works for the BEAST- right ) and that takes out a program that might help them.

  • bob.k posted a new activity comment 1 year ago

    Hi PhillyP “The Easy Way for Women to Stop Drinking” by Allen Carr could help. He talks about the challengers women face re enviroment etc- a couple of women helped him write it or wrote it for him Ha Ha

  • bob.k posted a new activity comment 1 year ago

    Hi @Chris101 I will point out the obvious if you didn’t t have the first sip the 9th drink could not have happened. Have you read Russell Brands book “Recovery -Freedom from Addictions” it about his journey through the 12 steps. Often giving up the drink is not enough to keep us sober, we have to sort out our thinking as well. otherwise can we think ourselves back into drinking.

  • bob.k posted a new activity comment 1 year ago

    Hi MyAlibi each second is a small step in the direction you want to go -right

    • Yes. Thank you. I must remember to be grateful when I am able to see a glimpse of a better future instead of black out drinking and catapulting myself into a past that I am no longer able to manage. Thank you again, it means so much that you acknowledged my very first post here with encouragement.

  • bob.k posted a new activity comment 1 year ago

    Hi Trace I have read the 5 chapters you are right its a “keeper” I will buy the book for my library then I can lend it out to those that still suffer. It explains addiction “the how and the why” better then I can. It confirms what I have been thinking for a long time -that normal people are the ones that don’t drink alcohol ever.

  • bob.k posted a new activity comment 1 year ago

    so he grows it you process it and that’s saves money– a win win maybe @craftygirl

  • bob.k posted a new activity comment 1 year ago

    Hi @craftygirl— was doing the pickling your idea or his?

    • Definitely his. He plants a huge garden every year. Not my favorite thing, but I help out, does save money on grocery bills.

  • bob.k posted a new activity comment 1 year ago

    Hi @Ellislou thinking of you.

  • bob.k posted a new activity comment 1 year ago

    Hi R51 the fact that you are asking yourself these questions is a good thing. take nothing for granted

  • bob.k posted a new activity comment 1 year ago

    Hi @Nicky77 well done on three months at rehab and hanging in there so far. At rehab did they give you tools to manage life when you got home? What you are going through (mixed and unknown emotions) is normal for anyone who has stopped drinking. fear of the unknown can be a big one. I know a number of woman that use AA meetings as an opportunity to get timeout from family. its a time when they can focus on their needs and catch up with others in the same situation.

    • That is what I am doing right now. Getting to as many meetings as possible. Just to be around the right people. Thanks

  • bob.k posted a new activity comment 1 year ago

    Hi @Stevef yea play it forward– you are right booze would have made it worse.

  • bob.k posted a new activity comment 1 year ago

    Hi @Serenaville is it possible for you and your husband to find something else that you can do together during this time? go for a walk, hug a tree, cook something– this can give the same buzz that u get from a drink. One thing I have never understood is that given the damage alcohol does to relationships/families, is why a spouse/partner of an alcoholic would want alcohol in the house, as for drinking it in front of them—- there is nothing abnormal about not drinking alcohol

  • bob.k posted a new activity comment 1 year ago

    Hi Trace UTIs are part of my life, If it is E.coli which is the most common, cranberry capsules can help.

  • bob.k posted an update 1 year ago

    the good news is- the days are getting longer, 5 hours more daylight on the longest day -bring it on

  • bob.k posted a new activity comment 1 year ago

    Hi @Kerris buying things can give the same good feeling that alcohol does and have the similar negative consequences http://www.addictionrecov.org/Addictions/index.aspx?AID=34

    • Thank goodness I’m not addicted to shopping 🙂

      • @kerris those boots were made for walking! X As the song goes x wear your red boots with pride. I had the same thing with some gold boots a couple of years ago. Stylish feet can walk with pride. x

  • bob.k posted a new activity comment 1 year ago

    yep DON’T GET COMPLACENT PEOPLE very very very very good advice. that addicted part of our mind never dies. well it does when we do

  • bob.k posted a new activity comment 1 year ago

    If that’s what you want– why not

  • bob.k posted a new activity comment 1 year ago

    Hi @bingerwhinger Good luck with your new beginning. At 28 I was where you are now. Some time ago I was at a sales training workshop and the trainer made this comment “I will tell you something about lucky people, Lucky people plan on being lucky”. So get yourself a plan. These one liners are part of my plan when it comes to not drinking, if offed a drink its “no thanks it used to get me into a power of shit” or if drinking comes up in a conversation same ” I don’t drink any more as it used to get me into a power of shit” .Two things come out of this (1) it helps keep my concise mind in defense mode, You call it a “Monster” I call it “the Enemy”. (2) Most people understand what I am talking about, they have a friend/family member or a friend that has a family member who abuses alcohol so they understand the mess that alcohol can cause, this may lead to a conversation and usually my EMNEMY gets another “smack on the head” and other person walks away with something to think about and with a bit of hope maybe, so there can be a gift in it for both of us. Being AF does not mean I am “abnormal” -different maybe, but different is just different not bad. Another one liner is “Don’t let the things you choose not to do get in the way of the thing you can do”. Develop an “Attitude of Gratitude” for the good things that are going on around you. http://www.virtuesforlife.com/two-wolves/

  • bob.k posted a new activity comment 1 year ago

    Hi @Sal07 i remember getting to 6 months sober and things were good and i was thinks that something bad going happen soon but then i looked back over the 6 month’s and there was shit that had happened but that’s not where my focus was. I was looking for the good stuff and that is what i had seen. http://www.virtuesforlife.com/two-wolves/

  • bob.k posted a new activity comment 1 year ago

    Hi MissFreedom it about you deciding what your future is going to look like, is having a dope smoking husband maybe father to your kids going to work for you? . Maybe I am being a bit harsh but that’s the real world of addiction. drug or alcohol abuse = pain
    Well done going to rehab and 2 month sober you are changing the things that you can change- you.
    You are the one to decide who your friends will be, but they will determined the person you become.

  • bob.k posted a new activity comment 1 year ago

    Hi @Shelives an assessment is where everyone has to starts from and I would think that the A@D unit would have there own counsellors so could be a different experience to what you had last time. As Ro says the fix has to come from within but sometime we have been on the merry-go-round for so long we can use a bit of help to stop it and take the first steps to get off it. Often people close to us are on a their own merry-go-round that is intertwined with ours but theirs does not stop when ours does and they don’t step off when we do and this can create some challengers for relationships. It good that your partner is interested in your recovery. If he could sit in during some of your counselling sessions that may help. Is it possible that two of you could read relevant books together or look at videos about addiction and recovery on YouTube, You can find ones that people have recommended on this site.– Take care of your self

  • bob.k posted a new activity comment 1 year, 1 month ago

    Hi Dylan.John have you tried AA. Hanging out with, talking and listening to people that have been there done that helped me sort out the lonely bit and gave me hope. I found Russell Brands book “Recovery from Addiction” interesting
    Veronica Valli FB group https://www.facebook.com/groups/Soberful/ she has some good videos on her page plus a program that might help.
    Annie Graces https://thisnakedmind.com/blog/ opens up some opportunities as well.
    I found stopping drinking the easy bit, I did it a number of times but living life on life’s terms sober was hard work. Take care of your self

    • AA probably saved my life and Russell Brands book was my catalyst for change in the first place
      I stopped going to AA because my sickness gotthe better of me, I know I need to go back
      thanks for your kind words
      tomorrow is a new day I guess

      • Hey Dylan John I’ve broken more that once – know all the bad feelings you’re talking about. But it sounds like you’re working back towards giving it another go – I’m new here and this place does help – cheering you on from the sidelines

  • bob.k posted a new activity comment 1 year, 1 month ago

    Hi @craftygirl with family it “don’t tell me show me” and that takes time. In AA they talk about “making amends to those we have harmed”, making amends is not an apology, its about making an effort to right a wrong and we do that by looking after ourselves first then we are able to look after those around us.

  • bob.k posted a new activity comment 1 year, 1 month ago

    Hi Zinny01 I liked your post I have been going to AA meetings for a day or two and I still enjoy them for the reasons you mentioned. Its very rare for me to go home from a meeting and not take something with me that will make my tomorrow a bit better one way or another. its about give and take

  • bob.k posted a new activity comment 1 year, 1 month ago

    hi NigelPM 70 days is a good start. sober is better nobody will argue against that.

  • bob.k posted a new activity comment 1 year, 1 month ago

    Hi @Lizzy there is nothing wrong with you. Your addiction does not let you go just because you have stopped drinking. those life experiences are still in your subconscious mind and it remembers the good times and wants them back, that part of the brain is not in contact with your concise mind which remembers the bad times hence the conflict. What you will find is that as you get further away from your last drink the discussions will become less intense but may never go away so we need to stay vigilant. When the those thoughts come recognize them for what they are, have a chuckle to yourself “that’s not me any more” and get on with the rest of your day.

    • Hi @bob-k thank you for your reply… very helpful, your words have really made me think. I recoiled from you saying “your addiction” which is interesting isnt it! Of course I was addicted. And if i were to start drinking again I know I would quickly become addicted again. So yes, you are absolutely right to say that my addiction doesnt let me go just because I stopped drinking and that I need to be vigilant and I need to remember my drinking days for what they were.

  • bob.k posted a new activity comment 1 year, 1 month ago

    Hi @MrWTF I am not a cat man but I have had dogs that have moved on one died the other I sold, she was a working dog and I moved into town so it was not fair on her and yes there were tears. I got Sam ( a huntaway pup) when I was 3 weeks sober, he sat by my side for 8 years and then came Sue another huntaway

  • bob.k posted a new activity comment 1 year, 1 month ago

    Hi @chameleon hope for the best and be prepared for the worst.. Maybe talk to a counsellor yourself, someone that has knowledge of the emotional damage done to people that are or have lived with an alcoholic. Family members, adults and kids usually go into survival mode as a coping mechanism when living with an alcoholic and some of the habits learnt can be unhealth and get in the way of a family’s healing. His drinking has caused the problems but it will take the two of you working on yourselves and your relationship to bring your family together in a way that is strong and healthy. If you and your husband don’t get back together the counselling could help you re getting on with your life. The only thing you have control of are the things you do.

  • bob.k posted a new activity comment 1 year, 1 month ago

    Hi @Esharp76 I had a fall 8 years ago, now in a wheelchair a paraplegic and I get a bit annoyed with people that tell me that “it could be a lot worse” or “there are a lot of people worse of than you are”, they are right, but I am like–“really, how does that help me” and then I think, they are just trying to be helpful or they don’t know what else to say, so I let it go.

    • Gosh @bob-k I’m really sorry to hear that, I would never say that to you! You would have my compassion and support, as you do now! You’re strong and buggar the stupid people and their stupid comments. Hope life is being kind to you now! Kia kaha

  • bob.k posted a new activity comment 1 year, 1 month ago

    Hi @colin 60 days is good keep at it

  • bob.k posted a new activity comment 1 year, 1 month ago

    Hi @ellislou i don’t know you but sort of do if that makes sense. we are on a similar journey i am a bit further down the road maybe, It cant be worked out nor it cant be made sense of, so its a matter of living with “what is” and we are doing that every day, this can mean finding our way around in the dark for a time and that tough going. my experience is that as time goes on the sun shines though eventually but in a different sort of a way and different is just different not bad. Take care and look after your self

    • Thanks bob.k yes that’s a hard one i need to learn is that different is not bad just different – thank you !
      Someone said to me look how nature strips the trees bare in autumn for the winter – it’s hard but not bad

  • bob.k posted a new activity comment 1 year, 1 month ago

    hi @chameleon https://www.al-anon.org.nz/index there is a contact ph number on the bottom of their web page. the map shows that there is a group in Gisborne. Might not be your thing but it will give you somewhere to start, an opportunity to meet with people that know a bit about the path you are walking. Take care

  • bob.k posted an update 1 year, 1 month ago

    How are you doing @sobere No offence taken, questions are good gets my mind working. I think most people find AA a bit weird its definitely different. To start with we are in room we would rather not be in, with people we know nothing about plus we all have our own perception of what an alcoholic is and nobody wants to be one of those. Most meeting start with the Serenity Prayer and the first word is God which has negative cognitions for a lot of us so we are on the back foot to start with, add the fact that we had did come into the room hopping and skipping with a big smile on our face, we are generally in pain and our lives are in a bit of a mess, we had come to the meeting looking something to deal with the pain and sort the mess, the mess is often that someone close to us has said “sort your shit out I/we have had enough” or something similar The thing that is really weird is our behavior. People that are Lactose Intolerant don’t put milk in their coffee, not even a little bit, those that get sick when they eating peanuts don’t eat cake that might have peanuts in it, simple really, yet for some reason or other we keep on having that first sip of alcohol long after it starts causing problems in our lives.

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